What would Morrissey from the 80's think of Himself in 2011 ???

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...Just thought I would try to start some kind of Sensible topic round here.....

They are obviously 2 very different people now, but, I wonder what His younger self would think of his recent "Behaviour" ( Tseng-ergate, not liking any "Band Member" snipes or criticisms on various web-sites, etc...).

I just personally find it pretty hypocritical that he is perfectly happy nowadays to be photographed with a convicted Violent Drunken thug, yet, back in the 80's, the same sort of Thug would have happily kicked the Living shite out of him, just for existing...
And yet, These people are now allowed entrance to his concerts ( and, of course, by implication,Encouraging the same sort of Thuggish lout to attend further gigs with such "Publicity"; and yet Long-Term fans ( who, to my knowledge, have never assaulted anyone in a Drunken, Mob-handed Brawl), are banned.
He has been happy to spout his opinions on just about every other artist that exists, ( MOSTLY Derogatory...)yet, when he hears of people opining on him and/or his Band, he gets all annoyed and Hissy-fitty.
Any further comments anyone wants to add/contribute???

(..And, if anyone is interested, I have loved the Smiths/Morrissey since 1983/84, and am very passionate about the mans music...just a bit Confuzzled about the way his mind is working lately...).

 

[PaleBlueDot]

(..And, if anyone is interested, I have loved the Smiths/Morrissey since 1983/84, and am very passionate about the mans music...just a bit Confuzzled about the way his mind is working lately...).

Lately?

 

[[email protected]]

Lately?

good call!!!

 

[Amy]

...Just thought I would try to start some kind of Sensible topic round here.....

They are obviously 2 very different people now, but, I wonder what His younger self would think of his recent "Behaviour" ( Tseng-ergate, not liking any "Band Member" snipes or criticisms on various web-sites, etc...).

I just personally find it pretty hypocritical that he is perfectly happy nowadays to be photographed with a convicted Violent Drunken thug, yet, back in the 80's, the same sort of Thug would have happily kicked the Living shite out of him, just for existing...
And yet, These people are now allowed entrance to his concerts ( and, of course, by implication,Encouraging the same sort of Thuggish lout to attend further gigs with such "Publicity"; and yet Long-Term fans ( who, to my knowledge, have never assaulted anyone in a Drunken, Mob-handed Brawl), are banned.
He has been happy to spout his opinions on just about every other artist that exists, ( MOSTLY Derogatory...)yet, when he hears of people opining on him and/or his Band, he gets all annoyed and Hissy-fitty.
Any further comments anyone wants to add/contribute???

(..And, if anyone is interested, I have loved the Smiths/Morrissey since 1983/84, and am very passionate about the mans music...just a bit Confuzzled about the way his mind is working lately...).

Well I don't think 80s Morrissey would have been happy with 'band criticism' either, certainly not of Johnny(!), but today's 'band' is a completely different situation/set-up and the fact he has refused to acknowledge that for 20 years changes nothing.

I think to some extent, Morrissey is dissatisfied with how his old 'image' has pigeonholed him in terms of what fans expect, so in recent years he's deliberately thrown us a few curveballs - the Rick Astley and Lady Gaga pictures, rock/punk type songs rather than pop - to prove that he's not the same person he was in the Smiths and he shouldn't have to be defined by that era. He did the same thing in the mid-90s with the whole 'Boxers' phase, trying to 'toughen up' how he was perceived. Whether he's been successful, well...that's a different debate.

 

[matt]

Probably "get off the stage"!

 

[GlasgowChivas]

I think you'd be surprised, as no matter what you may think about his recent output, the Morrissey of 2011 is the Morrissey of the 80's.

I don't think his attitude had changed, I don't think his outlook has changed, I certainly don't think his actions have changed.

Yes, the "attack" on Solo and Davidt certainly makes it "personal" to many on here but it's really no different to what he has done to countless others over the years and we've all been fascinated and amused by those incidents - so why should this one be any different.

Morrissey from the 80's would meet Morrissey from the 2011's and they would chat over the intervening years, the decisions, the fall outs, the band members and at the end of it the 80's Moz would call a press conference and announce that the as yet unreleased album will be his best yet - the material will be "strong", "urgent" and "relevant".

Musically, Morrissey has been able to choose his players for years so the "sound" that they create, that he accepts, that he puts his Name to, is unarguably the sound that he wants to be heard. So I don't think 80's Moz would have a problem with it either. In fact, I think he'd be envious that latter day Moz was able to get out a "heavier" sound, not beholden to the sound of The Smiths' - something Amy said above but far better than I.

Lyrically - I think there could be some friction. Latter day Moz is less capable of writing an interesting and biting lyric than 80's or even 90's Moz - but he still can. It's just more infrequent now.

Anyway, let's get building that Delorean and make this meeting happen. I'm sure 80's Moz would be as interested in reading the autobiography as we are.

 

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Hi GlasgowChivas...I think I know what you mean by "heavier" sound, ("You're gonna need someone on your side" and "Found found found" make me play air-guitar and do "Rock" poses with the hoover)...but, surely the Smiths made an un-godly Rock noise too? ( What she said/QID) !...I am not Criticising Boz and the lads at all, just saying that some people/trolls on here ( and elsewhere) have....and ( allegedly).. Morrissey is/has taken "umbrage" over this..
I am sort of referring to the fact that he is prepared to pose for photo opportunities Nowadays with the sort of Character that would have Smacked him, if he was to dare carry gladioli around the streets, and be so "Fey"...
( I am thinking of this because, in the 80's, I used to work in a "Ford" factory ( Halewood), and I was regularly singled out for "Ridicule" because I was a Smiths Fan(atic)...the place employed lots of Hard core Football fans, who hated the Smiths,( AND all things Mancunian..) and sort of hated me because I was a fan...one guy ( an LFC supporter) actually wanted to smack ME, because Morrissey had written a song called "Frankly Mr. shankly"...the dimwit hadn't even HEARD it, but was quite prepared to kick my head in for even liking such a song...Especially when it was written by ( in His words " A f***in' Manc c***"...)....I managed to get him to listen to the song , and he calmed down (Calm Down!!) when he realised it was Not, in fact written about a Scotsman, who used to manage Liverpool Football team, by "A Manc",...the mentality huh....at least his tattos were spelt right...)
I was also almost attacked on Thursday night-night shifts whenever the Smiths appeared on Top of the pops"...it was HARD being a fan in that factory...but I survived....sorry for rambling a bit there, but...I Really cannot see why Morrissey is so Welcoming to these sort of people, and yet banning Long devoted Fans....I bet there MUST be a Morrissey fan in Manchester who has had a similar experience to me when "Munich Air disaster 1958" was released....

 

[GlasgowChivas]

Hi Dave,
I think, really, is that even in the early days when he was identified as pale, skinny and fey, Morrissey had a longing and atrraction to the rougher element - and had they embraced him then he would have embraced them too. It was only later on, when he cultivated the 'Boxer' image that many "harder" types felt it ok to like Morrissey and not be a "poof". Joey Barton is a fan and has a dodgy past - that's perfect in Morrissey's eyes (in my opinion) - I mean he admired the Krays, openly and publicly, so it's not as if he's not got form.
It's his business though, everyone's free to idolise who they like. I just believe that the Moz we see know - while still a projection most of the time - is in fact closer to the real Moz than the one that emerged onto the stage in the 80's.

Of course, I say this having never met him, so could be completey wrong. But I'd be wrong in my own way

 

[Deleted member 6305]

"My God, I'm sexy."

 

[Comtesse]

You silly old man. You're making a fool of yourself.

 

[Amy]

Hi Dave,
I think, really, is that even in the early days when he was identified as pale, skinny and fey, Morrissey had a longing and atrraction to the rougher element - and had they embraced him then he would have embraced them too. It was only later on, when he cultivated the 'Boxer' image that many "harder" types felt it ok to like Morrissey and not be a "poof". Joey Barton is a fan and has a dodgy past - that's perfect in Morrissey's eyes (in my opinion) - I mean he admired the Krays, openly and publicly, so it's not as if he's not got form.
It's his business though, everyone's free to idolise who they like. I just believe that the Moz we see know - while still a projection most of the time - is in fact closer to the real Moz than the one that emerged onto the stage in the 80's.

Of course, I say this having never met him, so could be completey wrong. But I'd be wrong in my own way

I think you're spot on. Though I always saw Moz' attraction to the rough/violent element as being more of a sexual thing than anything else, much like his interest in James Dean, his obsession with skinheads etc - he loves the "the romance of crime" and the eroticised idea of violence but it doesn't mean that he really condones violent or thuggish behaviour. You can see that right from the very beginning - "I Want the One I Can't Have" - all through the Boxers phase and right up to "Action Is My Middle Name".

 

[murder and desire]

I think you're spot on. Though I always saw Moz' attraction to the rough/violent element as being more of a sexual thing than anything else, much like his interest in James Dean, his obsession with skinheads etc - he loves the "the romance of crime" and the eroticised idea of violence but it doesn't mean that he really condones violent or thuggish behaviour. You can see that right from the very beginning - "I Want the One I Can't Have" - all through the Boxers phase and right up to "Action Is My Middle Name".

I agree with amy and the Glasgow chap, in fact its something i have said on here time and time again. Morrissey is simply and an older richer version of who he always was. The trouble is its the fans who have changed. The "fans" (Including Russell Bland)believed the myth and the NME stereotype. Morrissey was never the bedroom wimp that people make out. Sensitive YES, Shy YES. Depressed with issue YES BUT never the wimpy myth that went around town.
In facy Morrissey is simply more himself than ever.

 

[loveblue]

I agree with amy and the Glasgow chap, in fact its something i have said on here time and time again. Morrissey is simply and an older richer version of who he always was. The trouble is its the fans who have changed. The "fans" (Including Russell Bland)believed the myth and the NME stereotype. Morrissey was never the bedroom wimp that people make out. Sensitive YES, Shy YES. Depressed with issue YES BUT never the wimpy myth that went around town.
In facy Morrissey is simply more himself than ever.

I agree with this. He's always been kind of an outsider & as funny as he is a little pissed. In the 90s when I saw him during his shows, I remember he didn't even look at the audience much. It would be an amazing thing if he looked up (at least if I saw him) and even more amazing if he said anything remotely substantial. In the mid 90s, I saw him have an argument at hammerstein where he called someone a pig. Now he interacts more, for better or worse. I think he's probably more himself than ever too. He's a lot more comfortable and being more who he is. I love his interaction. Of course, id feel bad if I was on the bad end of it like David

But a guy like that, who grew up in the manner he did, he's going to have those elements. I really admire morrissey bc through his art he's able to explore and express them. Whereas most have to supress them. most ppl who might be like that have a love hate relationship with this kind of nature. He's able to hang around with badasses and not get slack for it. Most ppl they hang out with a couple of badasses and their other friends judge them. Well sometimes ppl have different sides of themselves they're souls need to figure out. And just bc someones a badass doesn't mean they're bad. Sometimes they're the best people to be friends with ever over any fairweather friend you could ever find. Plus they introduce you to all kinds of crazy stuff. And morrissey does have that side of himself even in the early smiths days listen to the lyrics & he was interested in different kind of ways to begin with.

Anyway those are just my guesses.

 

[DAVIE]

"Oh dear, oh my....I really should have quit when I was 30!"

 

[peptastic]

Hi Dave,
I think, really, is that even in the early days when he was identified as pale, skinny and fey, Morrissey had a longing and atrraction to the rougher element - and had they embraced him then he would have embraced them too. It was only later on, when he cultivated the 'Boxer' image that many "harder" types felt it ok to like Morrissey and not be a "poof". Joey Barton is a fan and has a dodgy past - that's perfect in Morrissey's eyes (in my opinion) - I mean he admired the Krays, openly and publicly, so it's not as if he's not got form.
It's his business though, everyone's free to idolise who they like. I just believe that the Moz we see know - while still a projection most of the time - is in fact closer to the real Moz than the one that emerged onto the stage in the 80's.

Of course, I say this having never met him, so could be completey wrong. But I'd be wrong in my own way

I was going to post the same thing.
Moz quite likes felons.

I think he might have a go at himself however if it were his own idols names attached to things like banning fans from gigs and the like.
A rich guy telling other people what they can write and what isn't acceptable, etc.

He's free to insult that Buble fellow afterall but what would Buble say to reading the insults? I imagine he might not like it.
I guess Morrissey fans are an interesting kettle of fish. Moz doesn't like buble's music so being banned from a gig wouldn't be a tragedy. Moz fans insult the band but still WANT to see the shows.

 

[HousingOfficer]

He'd be as much at ease with himself as most 50 year old men. This growing older lark aint easy as one day you'll appreciate..

 

[Skylarker]

He's free to insult that Buble fellow afterall but what would Buble say to reading the insults? I imagine he might not like it.

Why would Buble give a shit what Morrissey thinks? He'd probably just laugh it off and ignore it, like most adults.

 

[M. Eateater]

We all do change. Thirty years is a long time. But a nazi is always a nazi, and some things never changes. Not even for The Stupid Racsist f***head.

 

[Girl-with-the-Thorn]

I agree with amy and the Glasgow chap, in fact its something i have said on here time and time again. Morrissey is simply and an older richer version of who he always was. The trouble is its the fans who have changed. The "fans" (Including Russell Bland)believed the myth and the NME stereotype. Morrissey was never the bedroom wimp that people make out. Sensitive YES, Shy YES. Depressed with issue YES BUT never the wimpy myth that went around town.
In facy Morrissey is simply more himself than ever.

I agree. Everyone changes over the course of 30 years, but I truly don't believe Morrissey has become as different a person/artist as many seem to think. I think that some people may have initially idolised the myth and the stereotype, and are just disappointed with who he's turned out to actually be. I'm not generalising here though- I think those people are probably in the minority. After all, despite many on here saying how much they despise Morrissey now and how they'll never listen to his music again, this site clearly doesn't represent every fan.

But a nazi is always a nazi, and some things never changes. Not even for The Stupid Racsist f***head.

That Nazi crap (and it really is utter crap) has been done to death. Use your imagination, at least.

 

[M. Eateater]

I agree. Everyone changes over the course of 30 years, but I truly don't believe Morrissey has become as different a person/artist as many seem to think. I think that some people may have initially idolised the myth and the stereotype, and are just disappointed with who he's turned out to actually be. I'm not generalising here though- I think those people are probably in the minority. After all, despite many on here saying how much they despise Morrissey now and how they'll never listen to his music again, this site clearly doesn't represent every fan.



That Nazi crap (and it really is utter crap) has been done to death. Use your imagination, at least.

A nazi defending another?