TTY: Glastonbury Festival is not animal friendly

Re: True to You: Glastonbury

http://true-to-you.net/morrissey_news_150409_01

9 April 2015

Glastonbury Festival is not animal friendly

barbarism begins at home

Last year the artist Banksy burst into the Glastonbury Festival with his very clever moving art-piece called Sirens of the Lambs, which shows the screaming faces of lambs crying out from a truck bound for slaughter of the most unimaginably corrupt and vicious savagery.
Michael Eavis, the gentlemanly God of Glastonbury, was not impressed.
"Is it some kind of animal rights thing?" he asked, pretending not to understand what the rest of us saw so clearly. No, Michael, it was a preview of the UK entry for the 2015 Eurovision Song Contest…

"Our cows are actually very happy," Michael Eavis, now suddenly Dr. Dolittle, assured reporters, "they have the highest milk yield in the county."
What Michael Eavis meant by this statement was: WE are economically very happy because our cows have the highest milk yield in the county. No Glastonbury cow was available for comment, and no cows were heard laughing. Dr. Eavis equates milk yield as a sign of happiness, we note.

In order to 'have the highest milk yield in the county', a cow must be persistently 'raped' against its will (a logical assumption), or it must be artificially inseminated from the age of 13 months onwards, or injected with bovine growth hormone. The latter is banned (that is, frowned upon) in the UK, but since farmers pay no heed to the law when it comes to gassing badgers, shooting foxes or hunting, then we're safe to assume that the bovine growth hormone practice continues. In the UK, the farmers' financial gluttony is unassailably up there with the holy scriptures.
Dairy cows are not allowed to not be in lactation because then their milk production decreases and they do not produce enough milk to justify the cost of their board and lodgings. Therefore, cows are repeatedly raped and raped and raped … which Michael Eavis presumably thinks is a great way to make sentient beings happy. Dairy cows are only allowed to live for as long as they are useful to the farmer, which is about 4 years. If left alone, the cow could live for 20 years.
I assume that the dairy cows at Glastonbury who no longer yield milk are brought into the home of Michael Eavis and allowed to sit down and watch Emmerdale until they gently pass away in their later years, because, after all, Michael insists that Glastonbury cows are "very happy."
In truth, of course, as soon as a cow is a substandard producer of milk, she and her friends are sent off to have their throats slit.
We can easily imagine Michael Eavis waving the cattle truck off, and we can see his cows being "very happy" about that, and waving back to Michael.
A male calf produced by a dairy cow is immediately shot, or raised to be murdered for beef, or allowed no daylight during its entire short lifespan where it is trapped in a crate, unable to move, and thus the creation of veal. After calving, newborns are hit on the head with a hammer or pulled away from their mothers after just one day together, which causes explosive stress to both mother and baby. Does Michael Eavis approve of this? It appears so. Milk is worse than "meat" because on dairy farms the cows are tortured for YEARS before they are killed. Calves are pulled away from their mothers by dragging the calf with one leg, both mother and calf in a state of chaotic distress.
Does Michael Eavis at his Glastonbury Farm accommodate any cows at all that do not yield money his way? I doubt it. Off with their heads!
Does Michael Eavis care about the insane environmental damage caused by dairy farming? I doubt it. To hell with the environment! People who do not care about animal rights usually do not care about human rights. It naturally follows.
Should you actually agree to play at the Glastonbury Festival you might find visual arts expert Michael Eavis meddling with your presentations. In 2011 I played Glastonbury and attempted to sing the song Meat is murder. Behind me, a screen that usually shows the many evils of factory farming remained blank. I was told that Michael Eavis had stopped the screening of the film because it wasn't indicative of how his dairy farm operated. He didn't quite understand that the poor souls in the actual film did not want to be there in the first place. Michael Eavis also went on to justify banning the film by saying it would "upset" younger people. What Michael Eavis was saying, in effect, was:

it's OK for our belly, but not for our eyes … and at all costs don't educate anyone on animal cruelty because it might damage the financial profits of our happy Glastonbury Farm.

If he had thought the film gave an incorrect view of dairy farming, he wouldn't have cared if the film had been shown, but he banned the film because he knew the film was truth.

Like most animal haters, Michael appears to be one of those people who love dead animals, yet hate live ones. How is this sane, or logical, or possible?
If dogs and cats aren't 'food', then why are cows and sheep? The BBC recently made a terrible fuss when some unfortunate dogs were allegedly poisoned at Crufts - which, yes, was abysmal. But the BBC had no concern or report on the 40,000 piglets whose throats were slit in the UK in that very same week.
Why is the latter not a BBC story? Why is a poisoned dog at Crufts a story for national lamentation, yet the slaughter of 40,000 screaming piglets is not mentioned anywhere on any known news program?
If a dog is not food, then why is a pig?
Well, you might argue that 'oooh I love bacon', but if you love the pig dead, why do you not love the pig while it is alive, and why do you not protect it from slaughter … if you "love" "bacon" so much? Surely if you eat animals it's because you hate rather than love them?
Is a cat 'food'? No. So why is a lamb?
We have been trained and brainwashed to believe that some animals deserve to be killed and some don't, and much advertising effort is put into the hope that we do not ever decide for ourselves. No celebrity vegetarian chefs on the BBC! There is also heavy reliance on the hope that humans never quite become intelligent enough to understand that both humans and animals have natural rights. After all, as Gary Yourofsky brilliantly observed: if you remove bees or ants from the planet the entire cycle of life is damaged, but if you remove human beings from the planet then the entire planet will prosper and be saved.
Should we care that factory farming (which isn't farming at all - it's an industry very much like any other) is irrefutably linked to cancer in humans? Are you aware that the "country smell" so powerful in idyllic areas is actually the smell of mass slaughter of animals? Does anyone actually believe that the badger kill (not 'cull') is a move to protect cows, or to protect godly farmers' income? Are you aware that the virus of factory farming causes more greenhouse gas emissions than all combined forms of motorized transport? Of course you're not, for if you knew how much the "meat" industry is destroying the planet, well, you might grow wise to the biggest threat to your own life.

Like many animal haters, Michael Eavis was awarded a CBE by Elizabeth Battenberg (you have been ordered to address her as The Queen) in 2007. In 2005 he expressed how it was "outrageous to ban hunting". For such as Michael Eavis, there just cannot be enough bloodshed. More! More! More! Kill! Kill! Kill! Would he object if the hunters were also hunted?

Animal rights is now the leading social justice issue on the planet. Your decision is whether you support either the butcher or the butchered. It cannot be both.

Morrissey
8 April 2015
 
I

Ah yeah don't need to be finding a link. I was there in 2004! I was a cute little 16 year old goth with terrible fashion sense and a boyfriend with the most ridiculous long blonde ringlets, so no photos, but I can confirm both me and Morrissey were there. He was dead good as well! I think I lost my virginity that night too. Good night for everybody eh.

Feel I must add, despite BB's desperate attempts to pin Moz as a heterosexual, the losing of my virginity had nothing to do with Morrissey, and more to do with the ease of lager and other inhibition-reducing substances at Glastonbury. Morrissey being there was just a coincidence.
 
I

Ah yeah don't need to be finding a link. I was there in 2004! I was a cute little 16 year old goth with terrible fashion sense and a boyfriend with the most ridiculous long blonde ringlets, so no photos, but I can confirm both me and Morrissey were there. He was dead good as well! I think I lost my virginity that night as too. Good night for everybody eh.

Link provided earlier by another helpful contributor. What's ridiculous about long blond ringlets? You *think* you lost your virginity that night? It was that good? Most people at least remember 'the first time'. No wonder you became a man-hating feminist. Anyway, I'm listening to 'Kick The Bride Down The Ailse' so he had a lucky escape by the sounds of it.

best
BB
 
Re: True to You: Glastonbury

He clearly is aware of this site enough to comment on it (hateful online creche, etc.) and there have been several instances where his behavior has struck me as being motivated by comments on this website

..;Well he did promise to f*** Solo at one point...Anybody felt anything yet? :)
 
Re: True to You: Glastonbury

on topic:

he's avoiding nasty fans in real life and have time to come here to read about nothing? does it make sense for you?


personally, knowing certain number of musicians/artists, there is not much time in their lives left for surfing.
when they come to the web, things like this are not their area of interest, believe it or not.



'professional' trolls know little about real life, this imaginary space gives them illusion of 'living'. they pretend to live.
if case is more serious (of mental health) they use web for some kind of 'therapy', it's better than to commit evil/crime in reality.


kind regards.

:rofl: :rofl:
 
Thanks for the links. I wonder if any reason was given for cancelling Glastonbury in 1992? The set lists for the gigs following Glastonbury do not include 'Meat Is Murder'.

best
BB

I think the reason in '92 was because he was having 'ahem' problems with a member of his band. Not sure if this was around the time Gary was busy stenciling in 'die wanker' on Moz's front door rather than making band rehearsals :lbf:

'Hey Gary you're late, where have you been?'


"Oh, nowhere.'
 
I think the reason in '92 was because he was having 'ahem' problems with a member of his band. Not sure if this was around the time Gary was busy stenciling in 'die wanker' on Moz's front door rather than making band rehearsals :lbf:

'Hey Gary you're late, where have you been?'


"Oh, nowhere.'


Well he did take him back after that, didn't he?
 
Feel I must add, despite BB's desperate attempts to pin Moz as a heterosexual, the losing of my virginity had nothing to do with Morrissey, and more to do with the ease of lager and other inhibition-reducing substances at Glastonbury. Morrissey being there was just a coincidence.

That´s true, it doesn´t matter in this thread, exept Morrissey took your viginity (what has to be proven as well)
 
Good morning campers! Welcome to the Glastonbury Music Festival 2011!

Google Search Results show the following totals under 'explore in depth' :

#Glastogate (90 more articles)
#Angoragate (6 more articles)
#KMALgate (27 more articles)

Clearly the most successful PR topic of the last few days has been 'The Glastonbury Music Festival Dairy Devils Conspiracy Theory/Factual Charge Sheet'. Michael and Emily Eavis are entirely silent on the subject and Morrissey himself has seemingly backed off from the implications of his allegations by posting some fluff about his successes with his 7 inches, but he's not doing his Terry Richardson xxx-lite fan-boy video KMAL stuff, he's talking about ye olde plastic single sales.

The implications of #Glastogate are simply mind-bending. If Morrissey provides evidence to prove his allegations, or the 'Evil Eavis Dairy Devil Empire' is unable to refute and debunk this issue, then what Morrissey has managed to do is detonate a metaphorical hydrogen bomb above the Pyramid Stage. If the Eavis Empire do NOT respond, then their brand, legacy and credibility is entirely trashed. Forever.

Suddenly the piffle of The BRITS seems entirely redundant. Here we have a festival whose main USP is 'diversity', which has been resolute in ensuring the visibility of black artists as headliners (and to a lesser degree, fought ubiquitous sexism on festival bills with Dolly and Beyonce) suddenly accused of censoring what Morrissey correctly calls "the leading social justice issue on the planet".

Next week, Glastonbury Music Festival will be re-selling returned tickets as a result of #Kanyegate where disgruntled 'rock' fans follow Noel Gallagher's lead in questioning the viability of MOBO headliners in this orgy of diversity. A petition to 'prevent' Kanye from playing at Glastonbury now has 134,000 signatures under the headline "Cancel Kanye West's headline slot and get a rock band."

https://www.change.org/p/glastonbury-festival-cancel-kanye-west-s-headline-slot-and-get-a-rock-band

However, there is no sign of any 'fan' on this site launching a similar petition on Morrissey's behalf. Actually, there's nothing to stop Morrissey launching it himself. Is there? "Please protest the censorship of my performance of 'Meat Is Murder' at Glastonbury 2011 by Michael Eavis and the BBC Countryfile programme" is all he needs as a title.

"Now I know how Kanye West feels....as the flames rose around the Pyramid Stage"


I remember Kanye at The Big Chill and the immortal "Hitler Rant". He'd booked a castle and a few hotels for his entourage and they all were strutting around Ye Olde Ledbury like it was Manhattan. Whilst the town is used to a polite poetry festival and occassional sightings of Robert Plant, they were confused and discombobulated by Kanye wandering in and out of their antique shops and Italian delis. Kanye thought it was because he was a rich black man in a white enclave of England. So on stage he let rip about people looking at him like he was Hitler. Paranoid? Perhaps. But is Morrissey also merely paranoid? Or is #Glastogate the greatest scandal ever to hit music. Ever!!!!

I hope Morrissey and Kanye join forces to protest these joint injustices, perhaps by Kanye doing the Beyonce 'celebrity vegan diet month dalliance' before his appearance and then covering 'Meat Is Murder'. This injustice cannot stand!!!!

If Morrissey's allegations are true, not only has he 'topped' any other bill topper in the history of Glastonbury Music Festival but, by going public, he may have reduced the entire stinking rancid meat and mediaeval toilet shit-sandwich of their brand to smoking rubble for eternity. What would he rather his legacy be? Topping the bill finally so Jarvis Cocker, the Gallaghers, The Verve, Coldplay, U2 and all the rest of the chancers and pretenders accept he was the real leader of the gang? Or, in a stroke of genius personal protest about censorship of public debate, reduce their entire circuses of 'achievement' and 'legendary status' to a risible footnote in the history of musicology?

So, is Morrissey strong enough to take on the entire apparatus of Carnism? After this statement of aligning his diet with his dictates, surely anything is now possible?

Yes, I am aware of the problems with you all rising up to protest censorship on a site Morrissey wishes to censor and whose proprietor Morrissey has 'banned' from public performances. I know that Morrissey has said some daft thinks to troll the debate on MOBO, so Kanye might not want to join forces with someone who once said "reggae is vile" and other calumnies..as a troll-lol-lol 'joke'.... I am also aware that Morrissey has closed comments on SRE's KMAL video 'experiment', but let's not quibble. Let's remember that Morrissey is insisting he isn't a troll bullshitter appropriating radical veganism, anti-racism and queer politics for lulz and column inches. With this statement he is claiming he is 4Real and has scratched the following on his arm with a foutain pen:

"Animal rights is now the leading social justice issue on the planet. Your decision is whether you support either the butcher or the butchered. It cannot be both. "

I look forward to his 'fan community' rising up as one to protest this world-historic injustice. And, trust me, if he's telling the truth, I'm being serious and irony isn't in it. Over to you, Michael and Emily. Morrissey is waiting patiently for a formal response. You are on trial. It's only a matter of time before TMZ get on it and trash whoever is bullshitting about the facts/fictions of this epochal story.

Welcome to #Glastogate.

best
BB

Kanye West Compares Himself to Hitler -- Big Chill 2011

 
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I see your point and agree. The difference though as i see it between adult human and non-human animals is that adult humans can thoughtfully make decisions that regard not only their own interests and feelings and that of their offspring but also the interests and feelings of other sentient beings.

Just as the law wouldn't punish a killer to the fullest who is/was mentally disadvantaged or a five-year-old that got hold of a gun that went off and killed the instructor, you cannot blame a snake for slugging down the frog. They are not responsible for what they are doing. They don’t have a choice.

But, at least in my eyes, every adult consumer and producer is to be held responsible because they have a choice.

I would say that the modern-day meat and dairy industry is just that: an insatiable wild animal stuck in the laws of survival of pre-historic times. It is an anachronism in our modern world. The consumers who support this system by purchasing its products reduce themselves willingly to wild animal offspring. They don’t want to be held responsible even though they are, as they have the brain capacity to make an adult buying decision that also includes the interests of other sentient beings. The producers are even worse than their wild counterparts in nature because they are insatiable. They are not only slaves of their thoughtless instincts but also slaves to the principles of profit maximization.

And why should we consider the feelings and interests of others when we make (buying) decisions? First, because as adult human animals we CAN make a difference and thus live up to our human potential, and secondly because from an evolutionary standpoint all non-human animals are our ancestors and thus belong to the family and need to be treated with respect.

(Sorry for being so longwinded here, but it is a bit difficult to bring across a point briefly in a foreign language.)

This isn't long-winded. It's a concise summary of many of the points Gary Yourofsky nails in his most important speech. As Morrissey has referenced Gary in this statement I think it's highly likely that direct exposure to Gary's passion and virility as a speaker was the epiphany that rescued Morrissey from the living hell of Cheesetarianism, rather than the #Cheesegate debates hosted on this site by David Tseng. Though I'm sure we all helped.

Recently Paloma Faith had Guardian commentator Owen Jones as her 'speaker-debater' support act in Cardiff the night before Morrissey played. She says "The music industry is scared of politics". Unfortunately, Morrissey didn't have the option of Gary as support act as he's banned from entering the UK because of his 'radical views'. So, Morrissey censored at Glastonbury, Gary Yourofsky banned. We can all see the connection?


best
BB

Gary Yourofsky - The Most Important Speech You Will Ever Hear



And for everyone at GCHQ and the various UK police forces monitoring my participation on this thread: you are wasting your time. As you know, any attempt to stop my Art Hound-Art Terrorism only results in more 'spectaculars'. Just as nobody at The Vatican realised what was happening when we took down Ratzinger and O'Brien, you will only know what has befallen you all when we detonate our memetic bomb above the Pyramid Stage at Unworthy Farm. Sharon has left the mental hospital but she is no longer my "Secretary". I have promoted her to Head Of Operations'. She is driving to Devizes right now to plan 'Operation Pyramid'. We will infiltrate the Dairy Devil lair of the Eavis Empire Of Evil. Your censorship will cost you more than you can imagine. We will be on the Tor when we press the button to post our results to YouTube. Make it so! "We are Anonymous. We are Legion. We do not forgive. We do not forget. Expect us!"
 
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You do NOT need to eat any animal products. Full stop. It's a choice.

But if you don't eat animal products you do need to take supplements to obtain those nutrients missing from your diet, notably vitamins B12 and D and omega 3. Please don't say you can eat unwashed fruit and vegetables to get B12, that approach will make you ill. We don't get enough sunlight year round in the UK for Vitamin D requirements to be met through exposure to sunlight alone and the short-chain variety of omega 3 that is present in foods such as walnuts isn't converted to the long-chain variety that the human body needs.

As you're a vegan you'll know that Donald Watson founded the Vegan Society in 1944 and after a few years some of the members mysteriously started to fall ill. It was found that they were suffering from the early stages of vitamin B12 deficiency. Thanks to supplements that can be overcome, but you must take them, or eat fortified foods, which is of course another way of ingesting a supplement. The Vegan Society advise anyone choosing a vegan diet to take B12 supplements, they even market their own multi-vitamin supplement containing vitamins D2, B2, B6, B12, and minerals iodine, folic acid and selenium (all absent from or low in a vegan diet) called Veg1. Trials were carried out a few years ago to see how well the multi-vitamins were being absorbed, everything was well absorbed bar the vitamin D2, so back to the drawingboard on that one. Vitamin D deficiency doesn't only cause rickets but is also responsible for depression, so it really is essential that we get enough vitamin D. Animal derived D3 is the only way the vitamin can be reliably absorbed by the body when people aren't exposed to enough sunlight. I'm afraid veganism will only ever be a fringe diet because most people prefer to get all the nutrients they need from the food they eat and are resistant to being told that they must take supplements in order to stay healthy and avoid deficiencies.

There's also the question of 'failure to thrive' on a vegan diet. Because the diet works for you that doesn't mean it will work for everyone. Probably more people have tried and given up with a vegan diet than stay vegan. Feeling lethargic and lacking concentration are symptoms reportedly experienced by some people who try a vegan diet. They are of course accused of not studying vegan nutrition well enough or being addicted to certain substances in animal foods, all well known tactics used by cult members to belittle those who leave the cult - and yes, veganism does share charateristics with cults - with only it's members knowing 'the truth' and what is good for everyone else.

It's very commendable to be concerned about the welfare of animals and how they're treated by human beings but some let that concern blind them to the impracticalities of the entire world adopting a vegan diet and lifestyle. The abolitionist approach is far too extreme for the vast majority of the human race to ever contemplate. For the animal's sake I'm sorry that's the case, but it is.
 
Excellent piece! About time people become aware of where their food comes from. I'm an omnivore and enjoy meat and dairy products, but all in moderation. The cruel and barbaric practices demonstrated is cause as to why 'Gluttony' made it into the deadly sins. Be aware and appreciative of where your food has come from, and what's a couple of dollars extra paid to ensure such cruelty is stopped. Some people don't have a choice as to where their next meal comes from, but for those with who do have a choice, get educated to what you're eating.
 
But if you don't eat animal products you do need to take supplements to obtain those nutrients missing from your diet, notably vitamins B12 and D and omega 3. Please don't say you can eat unwashed fruit and vegetables to get B12, that approach will make you ill. We don't get enough sunlight year round in the UK for Vitamin D requirements to be met through exposure to sunlight alone and the short-chain variety of omega 3 that is present in foods such as walnuts isn't converted to the long-chain variety that the human body needs.

As you're a vegan you'll know that Donald Watson founded the Vegan Society in 1944 and after a few years some of the members mysteriously started to fall ill. It was found that they were suffering from the early stages of vitamin B12 deficiency. Thanks to supplements that can be overcome, but you must take them, or eat fortified foods, which is of course another way of ingesting a supplement. The Vegan Society advise anyone choosing a vegan diet to take B12 supplements, they even market their own multi-vitamin supplement containing vitamins D2, B2, B6, B12, and minerals iodine, folic acid and selenium (all absent from or low in a vegan diet) called Veg1. Trials were carried out a few years ago to see how well the multi-vitamins were being absorbed, everything was well absorbed bar the vitamin D2, so back to the drawingboard on that one. Vitamin D deficiency doesn't only cause rickets but is also responsible for depression, so it really is essential that we get enough vitamin D. Animal derived D3 is the only way the vitamin can be reliably absorbed by the body when people aren't exposed to enough sunlight. I'm afraid veganism will only ever be a fringe diet because most people prefer to get all the nutrients they need from the food they eat and are resistant to being told that they must take supplements in order to stay healthy and avoid deficiencies.

There's also the question of 'failure to thrive' on a vegan diet. Because the diet works for you that doesn't mean it will work for everyone. Probably more people have tried and given up with a vegan diet than stay vegan. Feeling lethargic and lacking concentration are symptoms reportedly experienced by some people who try a vegan diet. They are of course accused of not studying vegan nutrition well enough or being addicted to certain substances in animal foods, all well known tactics used by cult members to belittle those who leave the cult - and yes, veganism does share charateristics with cults - with only it's members knowing 'the truth' and what is good for everyone else.

It's very commendable to be concerned about the welfare of animals and how they're treated by human beings but some let that concern blind them to the impracticalities of the entire world adopting a vegan diet and lifestyle. The abolitionist approach is far too extreme for the vast majority of the human race to ever contemplate. For the animal's sake I'm sorry that's the case, but it is.

we are carnivores.
are we going to berate cats who eat mice? arrest them?
 
But if you don't eat animal products you do need to take supplements to obtain those nutrients missing from your diet, notably vitamins B12 and D and omega 3. Please don't say you can eat unwashed fruit and vegetables to get B12, that approach will make you ill. We don't get enough sunlight year round in the UK for Vitamin D requirements to be met through exposure to sunlight alone and the short-chain variety of omega 3 that is present in foods such as walnuts isn't converted to the long-chain variety that the human body needs.

As you're a vegan you'll know that Donald Watson founded the Vegan Society in 1944 and after a few years some of the members mysteriously started to fall ill. It was found that they were suffering from the early stages of vitamin B12 deficiency. Thanks to supplements that can be overcome, but you must take them, or eat fortified foods, which is of course another way of ingesting a supplement. The Vegan Society advise anyone choosing a vegan diet to take B12 supplements, they even market their own multi-vitamin supplement containing vitamins D2, B2, B6, B12, and minerals iodine, folic acid and selenium (all absent from or low in a vegan diet) called Veg1. Trials were carried out a few years ago to see how well the multi-vitamins were being absorbed, everything was well absorbed bar the vitamin D2, so back to the drawingboard on that one. Vitamin D deficiency doesn't only cause rickets but is also responsible for depression, so it really is essential that we get enough vitamin D. Animal derived D3 is the only way the vitamin can be reliably absorbed by the body when people aren't exposed to enough sunlight. I'm afraid veganism will only ever be a fringe diet because most people prefer to get all the nutrients they need from the food they eat and are resistant to being told that they must take supplements in order to stay healthy and avoid deficiencies.

There's also the question of 'failure to thrive' on a vegan diet. Because the diet works for you that doesn't mean it will work for everyone. Probably more people have tried and given up with a vegan diet than stay vegan. Feeling lethargic and lacking concentration are symptoms reportedly experienced by some people who try a vegan diet. They are of course accused of not studying vegan nutrition well enough or being addicted to certain substances in animal foods, all well known tactics used by cult members to belittle those who leave the cult - and yes, veganism does share charateristics with cults - with only it's members knowing 'the truth' and what is good for everyone else.

It's very commendable to be concerned about the welfare of animals and how they're treated by human beings but some let that concern blind them to the impracticalities of the entire world adopting a vegan diet and lifestyle. The abolitionist approach is far too extreme for the vast majority of the human race to ever contemplate. For the animal's sake I'm sorry that's the case, but it is.

This is an entirely specious attempt to divert the issue away from the rights of non-human animals. Our current industrial civilisation can only sustain Carnism because of chemically produced nitrogen. Meat, cheese, eggs and milk are a cocktail of artificial chemicals without which they couldn't be produced and those chemicals will kill you. You are claiming to refute veganism on the basis of some 'natural fallacy' about human diets when most humans, especially carnivores, eat utterly unnatural diets which are no more than chemical cocktails. Animals do not produce Vitamin B12, they absorb it from the soil. Your dismissal of human B12 absorption from soil residues as toxic is pretty desperate given the e-coli, campylobacter, salmonella you risk each and every time you eat animal flesh to absorb B12 secondhand. And ludicrous given the supplementation of animal feed with B12!!!

The science on all of this is utterly contested and the ideology and lobbying cults like Weston A Price makes sure that the simplistic argument you present is accepted without further discussion by most people. As an example, your knowledge of the science is beyond ludicrous. Omega 3 is found in abundance in plant foods:

http://plenteousveg.com/vegan-sources-omega-3/


Trying to stop the research clock in 1944 with regard to B12 is pretty silly given the ongoing research into the bioavailabilty of B12 analogues in certain mushrooms. Vitamin D is also a non-issue given the existence of Vitashine and there is enough sunshine in the UK, the fact is most people are indoors and do not expose their skin to it with a sufficient sun-protocol. That's a factor of industrial civilisation and clock slavery at jobs, nothing to do with 'nature'. Those who suffer from SAD need sun lamps in winter. It's hilarious that you suggest that animal should accept slaughter rather than that we upcycle to UV winter workplace lighting.

https://www.vitamindcouncil.org/blog/uv-light-in-the-wintertime/

http://vitashine-d3.com/

You cannot plausibly claim that diet supplementation for veganism is 'unnatural' when nearly all animal feed is supplemented, animals are a laboratory of artificial chemicals, and our civilisation is only sustainable by chemical diets. You cannot dismiss veganism as 'unnatural' by reference to a totally unnatural chemical -based industrial production of meat, cheese, eggs, fish. You cannot calim that 'organic' meat is natural when cows, pigs, sheep and hens are human 'pets' bred from their natural forebears purely as food machines. In closing, you cannot expect me to regard you as anything more than a troll when you have quite clearly failed to research the vegan perspectives on all this.

You do not eat 'natural' meat in a 'natural' environment. You are a product of a chemical, electrical civilisation that has nearly destroyed the last vestiges of 'nature'. To appeal to periods of omnivore survivalism in certain locations and periods of human history is to reveal your true agenda as a typical propagandist of Carnism. Whether or not you realise you are a programmed droid of Carnism is irrelevant. You might want to start researching this beyond information that conforms to your existing prejuidices. Google 'confirmation bias' then start here:

"The American Journal of Clinical Nutrition reports that 39% of Americans have low levels of B12. If only 1% of Americans are vegan, how can a B12 deficiency be a vegan issue? "

http://www.adaptt.org/veganism.html#


There is no uniform Church of Veganism though some interpretations of it are cultish, just as there are cults within Carnism such as Paelo and Atkins. Please, try something original! You follow the cult consensus epicFAIL! attempts to debunk Veganism rather than face up to your complicity in the holocaust of non-human animals. If you want to reply, then you'll need to bebunk the following 4 min video. Good luck with that one! LOL!

best
BB

 
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Even though CG is unable to participate in this thread due to shock and awe at the success of the Art-Hounds Art-Terrorist project known as #Cheesgate, I am pleased to confirm I am also seeing 'signs' in the 'birds' of the nearby woodland. The 'birds' are telling me that the truth will free the world from it's enslavement to the Pyramid Stage, a temple to Carnism on which Morrissey was sacrificed by the the High Pries of the Dairy Devils, Michael Eavis and by the BBC CountryVile covert operations propaganda unit.

"Eggs.Meat.Milk.Cheese: Murder"

best
BB

 
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But if you don't eat animal products you do need to take supplements to obtain those nutrients missing from your diet, notably vitamins B12 and D and omega 3. Please don't say you can eat unwashed fruit and vegetables to get B12, that approach will make you ill. We don't get enough sunlight year round in the UK for Vitamin D requirements to be met through exposure to sunlight alone and the short-chain variety of omega 3 that is present in foods such as walnuts isn't converted to the long-chain variety that the human body needs.

As you're a vegan you'll know that Donald Watson founded the Vegan Society in 1944 and after a few years some of the members mysteriously started to fall ill. It was found that they were suffering from the early stages of vitamin B12 deficiency. Thanks to supplements that can be overcome, but you must take them, or eat fortified foods, which is of course another way of ingesting a supplement. The Vegan Society advise anyone choosing a vegan diet to take B12 supplements, they even market their own multi-vitamin supplement containing vitamins D2, B2, B6, B12, and minerals iodine, folic acid and selenium (all absent from or low in a vegan diet) called Veg1. Trials were carried out a few years ago to see how well the multi-vitamins were being absorbed, everything was well absorbed bar the vitamin D2, so back to the drawingboard on that one. Vitamin D deficiency doesn't only cause rickets but is also responsible for depression, so it really is essential that we get enough vitamin D. Animal derived D3 is the only way the vitamin can be reliably absorbed by the body when people aren't exposed to enough sunlight. I'm afraid veganism will only ever be a fringe diet because most people prefer to get all the nutrients they need from the food they eat and are resistant to being told that they must take supplements in order to stay healthy and avoid deficiencies.

There's also the question of 'failure to thrive' on a vegan diet. Because the diet works for you that doesn't mean it will work for everyone. Probably more people have tried and given up with a vegan diet than stay vegan. Feeling lethargic and lacking concentration are symptoms reportedly experienced by some people who try a vegan diet. They are of course accused of not studying vegan nutrition well enough or being addicted to certain substances in animal foods, all well known tactics used by cult members to belittle those who leave the cult - and yes, veganism does share charateristics with cults - with only it's members knowing 'the truth' and what is good for everyone else.

It's very commendable to be concerned about the welfare of animals and how they're treated by human beings but some let that concern blind them to the impracticalities of the entire world adopting a vegan diet and lifestyle. The abolitionist approach is far too extreme for the vast majority of the human race to ever contemplate. For the animal's sake I'm sorry that's the case, but it is.

I think BB answered your B12 fallacy. It is not isolated to a vegan diet. Neither is your vitamin D nonsense.

The only slight truth in your statement is the ALA to DHA conversion but I suggest you read the following from AJCN before you make further claims. The conclusion suggests that vegans develop better ALA conversion than fish-eaters: http://ajcn.nutrition.org/content/92/5/1040.full?sid=8b706b2d-5cc0-4caf-b001-e3ef83f74e62

I am sorry to disappoint you but you were sold a bag of non-sense... maybe from the meat and dairy industries?
 
Even though CG is unable to participate in this thread due to shock and awe at the success of the Art-Hounds Art-Terrorist project known as #Cheesgate, I am pleased to confirm I am also seeing 'signs' in the 'birds' of the nearby woodland. The 'birds' are telling me that the truth will free the world from it's enslavement to the Pyramid Stage, a temple to Carnism on which Morrissey was sacrificed by the the High Pries of the Dairy Devils, Michael Eavis and by the BBC CountryVile covert operations propaganda unit.

"Eggs.Meat.Milk.Cheese: Murder"

best
BB



jesus brian mays locks never fails to amaze me:blushing:
 
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